A bad place for sure

Mike Connelly Vincent Neary

Photo: Connaught Telegraph (Alison Laredo)

I spent some time earlier on trying to put together a considered piece on the crisis that erupted into the open inside the last 24 hours but, having since watched the RTÉ News item and then Vincent Neary’s frankly embarrassing interview on Newstalk’s Off The Ball programme, I can see that now is not the time for the piece I had in mind. Aside from anything else, events in the unfolding crisis are moving rapidly so it’s best to try to keep up with what’s happening. There’ll be time for reflection further down the road.

For those who haven’t seen or heard the two pieces, here they are: RTÉ News (includes video) and Off The Ball.

The County Board officers are obviously taking the line that there’s a “process” in place to deal with management/player issues and that as far as they’re concerned the crisis has flared up out of the blue. Vincent Neary went so far as to describe it as a “total bombshell”.  Both Mike and Vincent were focusing in on the reasons for why the revolt has happened, with the latter confirming that a planned meeting with the players’ representatives would be going ahead this Thursday.

None of this, I’m afraid, is in the least bit credible. This isn’t some kind of family row that can be soothed over by a bit of candid discussion between the Board and the players’ reps. The precise reasons behind what provoked the revolt are likely to come out in time but sitting down trying to “tease out” what these are won’t help solve the immediate problem that’s staring the Board squarely in the face right now.

This is the brutal fact that a large majority of the players have expressed their lack of confidence in the current management and, having done so, it’s all but impossible to see how Noel and Pat can remain in their positions. While many will have sympathy with Noel and Pat (and I’d have some myself) it’s clear that their relationship with the players has been sundered irrevocably and the Board needs to wake up fairly quickly to this fact.

Instead of trying to put this particular Humpty Dumpty back together again, the Board needs to bring Noel and Pat’s tenure to an end as swiftly and humanely as they can, preferably by both tendering their resignations. They then need to move with equal speed in starting the process to identify the best possible replacement. And this time, unlike twelve months ago, there can be no fast ones pulled in the appointment process.

Mike Connelly was correct when he said on that RTÉ piece this evening that “we’re in a bad place” right now. What Mike and his County Board colleagues need to recognise, however, is that it’s up to them to move decisively to get us out of that place and quickly. Otherwise what’s already a bad situation can only get immeasurably worse.

60 thoughts on “A bad place for sure

  1. A very short and simple press release from The County Board, outlining their position, would have been far more appropriate than Neary talking to ‘Off The Ball’. I’m not sure what he was trying to achieve to be honest. Things really could be run a lot smoother upstairs in McHale Park

  2. Well said, very well thought out piece, my hope is that this will not be played out through the media. So many rumours flying about now it’s hard to know anything.

    Plans please Vincent don’t go on off the ball Again.

  3. Having firsthand experience of the CB workings WJ, I’m afraid your asking the equivalent of a blue arsed baboon to recite the complete works of Shakespeare.

  4. The piece in the Irish Times will do nothing to help resolve the issue and will probably make it worse. It’s clear from the piece who was feeding Malachy Clerkin information. In my opinion,there is something bigger at play but will the management go unless this is released? Logistical issues aren’t that important in the grand scheme of things

  5. I didn’t realise until I heard Nearys interview that Mike Connelly the chair of the co board is also the liaison man between the team and the board. I’m trying to figure that one out as how that works.

    Imagine the CEO of Apple being the liaison man with the tech team designing the phones. Then back in the board room he dons a different hat and sits in a different chair. Throw in the CEO having a brother as a senior executive within the company . That would lead to a rather weird kind of meeting.

    Put another way, I doubt if Costello the Dublin CEO bothers tangling with the team and also trying to run a virtual company. He Would distance himself from that. WJ is correct. The board needs to sort this fast and show they know that they have a grip. I’m still confused by Nearys interview and subdued by it. The players have spoken and the managers have been told that they are not wanted.

    That might be cruel , that might even be wrong but that’s what happened. This won’t be fixed with a mediator , forced smiles and shake hands with promises of all trying better next year. Whilst the players may not have thought the issue fully out, they made one thing clear, they want a change. I admire them for their balls.

  6. I don’t think I have ever heard anything as bad as our co secretary on OTB,btw why was the PRO not sent out to do it ?

  7. This is all ok, and I agree that they must be replaced. These players deserve much credit for this brave step.
    They realise that they have 2/3 more years max at the top and I suppose in a way can spot guys who are the real deal.
    The big thing here is who’s next? We are not exactly blessed with options and as WJ pointed out the next move in vital.
    Or else the best crop weev ever had will go without.
    And knowing our CB this is a real and present danger.

  8. That piece by Malachy Clerkin that John Paul referred to is here. It’s well worth a read and it’s very hard, in light of it, to see how anyone, least of all the County Board, could see the player revolt as a “bombshell”.

  9. Off the ball interview surely not Vincent’s finest hour and he’s a man I admire and have found personable and helpful. This mornings news flash could not have come as a bombshell to the County Board. Heck, I a humble club official, have known about this for a lot more than a week.

  10. My god that guy on off the ball was an embarrassment to your proud County . If that is what the players are dealing with they were dead right to revolt

  11. whatever about Holmes and Connelly, Vincent Neary has to go. Lord God, that interview was pure shite.

    It shows how out of touch the Mayo Co. Board are with the whole thing. FFS everyone had heard about this at 8p.m. last night.

    But Im afraid this goes back to the debacle of last year and the appointment process.
    Remember the Co. Board meeting where not one club delegate spoke out against Paddy McNicholas. Just before he exited stage left to take up his position in the Connaught Council.

    Remember the farce of the “appointment” asking McStay to go for a job that was no longer available?

    Remember the round of applause when a check for 8000 euro was “delivered” after the New York trip? (funny how Kerry raised half a million)

    We are not supporting the Mayo football team, we are paying a mortgage on a stand in Castlebar.

    The Co. Board are beyond a joke. Not one of them took the then president of the GAA Liam O’Neill to task over his comments about Mayo last year.
    Not one mentioned the performance of referee in Limerick. Do you think Kerry, Tyrone or Dublin would stand for that?

    And while our players are used as pawns to pay for this stand, let us not forget that there was not one championship match in Castlebar this year.
    No wonder there was no objections in going to Limerick last year. The boys love a day out.

    The players and supporters are together (this supporter is with the players anyway). Now is the time to have a complete clear out of Co. board.
    Im sure Pat & Noel tried their best, but they know the game is up. So step aside lads.

    Im not interested in a mortgage in mchale park. I want the players to have the best of everything. Dublin have it, Kerry have it and Tyrone have it and
    if we want it we will get it. But you have to want it.

  12. Look it. Just listened to the Vincent Neary interview. Look it.

    Oh dear oh dear oh dear.

    Look it. The more you learn about the individuals who we have on the County board, the more you can see how rotten and badly run the whole thing is.

    Look it. Is there anything to be said for saying another owl mass?

  13. At this time we all need to support this team of player 200%. They obviously are doing this as they feel that there’s a snowballs chance in he’ll of them winning anything under this regime.
    I did hear it at the Connaught final that things were not good and communication was an issue along with few other things!
    Think by the sounds of things James will be back and hopefully get this project back on the road. Think James is possibly the only one capable of turning this around in time
    We must trust the players on this one!

  14. Fail to prepare..prepare to fail. You get one chance in a lifetime to break the mould. The players took their opportunity 5 years ago , but without a similar progression in the support structures off the field the county is being dragged back to that starting point of 5 years ago, the county had a blueprint with the report chaired by Liam horan, it was not the answer to everything by any means but every journey starts with a mission and vision, whither we like it or not is this the only way left for the current team of county players to make a difference for those coming after them ?

  15. Just listened to the Neary interview on OTB. I’ve heard a lot worse believe me.

    I thought he was reasonably measured – he could have gone baldheaded for the players and taken a hard line on discipline and the right of management to manage. His line of meeting with the players to go through the process or whatever, may sound waffly, but it wasn’t Frank Murphy, or the Cork County Board, and that, believe me, is a lot to be thankful for.

    I really, really wonder if the players have thought this through. They are the agents provocateur, so if they haven’t all the moves thought through, God help us. Malach Clerkin has a piece in the Times which details some of the gripes – they don’t seem to amount to a whole hill of beans. But the worrying thing is this: are the players capable of taking a change of direction or dealing with finger pointing when management do this, as they must?

    And there is the further question: what manager will come near this bunch now? what big time manager? Who would want those headaches? A james Horan return is a non-runner.

    The Clerkin piece is here: http://www.irishtimes.com/sport/gaelic-games/gaelic-football/malachy-clerkin-mayo-players-management-heave-well-signposted-1.2371796

  16. Fair play Pocaimora your comment is funny and we all need a laugh now.

    Interesting Lee Keegan broke ranks well done Leroy.

    Was the U21 manager interview on this evening, any result announced ?.

    The Irish Times piece has nothing substantive, there better be dam good reasons for the vote of no confidence and these reasons need to be put out in the public domain asap.

  17. Interesting regarding Leeroy. I hope there won’t be a rift now between players. We can kiss the whole thing goodbye if that’s the case.
    What an awful interview by Neary, he ain’t fooling anyone.
    I found it curious when he started talking about the fact that it’s a 15-man squad and any player would want to fill the jersey…. Could it be that there was disagreement between players and management regarding who gets picked…?

  18. I quote a previous piece of correspondence from a group of mayo players from a different generation : “Year after year we have seen to nought the county board bring to nought the hours of training which we have put in , but yet, believing it was outside our sphere as players , we have desisted from drawing your attention to the matter. Events in Tralee last Sunday have banished our indecision, however, and we feel the time has come when something must be done before football disappears completely in mayo – unwept, unhonoured and unsung. ” guess what happened next?

  19. Who is going to remove the County Board. Case of turkeys voting for Christmas. Players already taking a battering outside Mayo. They need to stick together and to see this through. Worrying already that 7 outside fold and Leroy gone public which is very unfortunate. Has to be the lowest place we have been with Mayo Football for years. County Board are a disgrace!

  20. Can’t see where Lee is quoted to have supported anyone. I did see it reported by someone who has plain made stuff up in the past. So pinch of salt needed there. Especially considering that in his other article he made no effort whatsoever to hide how much he loved Pat Holmes!

  21. Agree Ken but you’d naturally assume the 7 would be the clubmates of the joint managers perhaps or lads who were ultimately grateful for gametime they received that they mightn’t have done previously or whatever

    I think Keegan voting how he has is a significant enough development and if this really isn’t the black and white issue we might have thought it was, this will become even more of a mess

    No matter what these guys did, they have been great servants to Mayo football and until I’m proven otherwise I fully believe they do genuinely have the best interests of Mayo football at heart. I myself was relatively happy with how the season unfolded overall on the playing field to be honest. I don’t think we’re as good a team as Dublin regardless of our manager

    Something might come out publicly in the coming days to change my view, but I do have a degree of sympathy for the lads in fairness. It can’t be easy for two men to be the subject of such a story of this magnitude, and being now painted as villains in a way by several quarters, without their side of the story being common knowledge

    But there is something very clearly amiss and despite the opinions of multiple keyboard warriors from outside the county on Facebook, Twitter and the likes (some comments would make you truly weep for humanity, thank God for sites like this which is thankfully dominated with informed and interesting opinions), the players are no eejits and they wouldn’t be going to such drastic measures if there wasn’t some major issues at hand. I’m happy with what I have seen myself of the managers on the whole, but they must go, there’s no other option at all IMO- rightly or wrongly

    there’s a lot more to life than football but I’m heading for bed with a real uneasy feeling about this whole thing! dark times for Mayo football.

    maybe this time next year, however, we’ll be just coming down after an almighty celebratory All Ireland session and laughing at that ‘overblown crisis’ 12 months ago 🙂

  22. We were told last year players did not want Mchale and Mcstay. This was not contradicted by our player reps so I assume it was true.

    I remember last year at one point just before gavin duffy joined panel talk players were not happy with management.

    Players are not happy with connelly and Holmes now.

    If we get a new manager and he was to make some hard calls like dropping a player what would happen then I wonder?

  23. It’s all very sad. So many Screw Ups have been made this year by the CB and H&C that things have come to a head. I expect everything to come out in the coming days. I’m pretty furious with the CB as they know full well of all the problems the players have had over the past year. The spin and untruths that will come from them in the next while will be just laughable. Where is the PRO if the CB? He always goes missing when the shit hits the fan. The Chairman and Secretary are sent out and just look daft. They are an amateur joke.

    Lots of us know about how unhappy the players were during the year with one particular member of the joint management. They have to do what’s right and just walk away. Their appointment was based on the continuation of the Legacy that Horan left. Unfortunately a lot of that was dismantled with the loss of many of the back room team, physios etc. Lots of things were changed and the level of fitness and professionalism that the players were used to just weren’t there.

    I have lots of sympathy for the players. They have done us proud since 2011 and aren’t far away. An experienced manager with know how and an AI under his belt is what is required. McGuinness would be my choice and from what I know he hadn’t turned us down when he was approached. Jack O C was appointed Kerry U21 manager last night… Stephen Rochford would be my second choice. Not sure if he would take it though as he was treated terribly by the CB previously. Sure who could trust them?

    Hopefully this won’t drag on for weeks or months but I’m not so sure. The Connellys are tough and proud men and they don’t normally buckle to anyone. Martin carney quoting on the news “well who do the players want”. I would say Martin that they want a manager who knows what they are doing, who has a positive relationship with players and above all a manager who can motivate them to believe in their game plans and tactics.

    Joint management teams don’t work. If one says the opposite to what the other says, who does a player listen to? Who calls the shots? Who is in charge? It was all a disaster waiting to happen. Sad times but we can only hope and pray that the outcome will be a positive one.

  24. Read the article in the times

    A lot of it is true, was told for a fact about people outside the group / guys who obviously pumped in money been brought into the dressing room
    After big games

    In my opinion that is an absolute joke

    They have to go no coming back

  25. With regards to a blue arse baboon I recall seeing and more particularly hearing one in MacHale park the evening of the team’s homecoming after losing the final of 13 to Dublin the blue arsed baboon preceded to get up and take the mike and say “Murica (America to you and me) got Bin Ladin Mayo will get Sam”

  26. The obvious thought once this broke was “what if some players don’t agree?” Appears to be the case with leroy. One would also assume Barry Moran, cunniffe and paddy Durcan would be holmes supporters given he was their club manager but that’s not certain of course. It’s an absolute disaster – majority rules my arse. What if 45% of the players wanted to keep H&C? What then?

    Some one alluded to Fianna fail above – it’s not a political election for gods sake. If 100%, or at least 90% of players aren’t supportive of this move then it will be a disaster. You can’t have a “government” and an “opposition” in an intercounty dressing room. You need 100% buy in from everyone or nothing will be achieved.

  27. As a Mayo exile looking in from abroad I’m very disappointed reading this news.
    Mayo football should be more about enjoyment and good times . Through out my life following Mayo there’s always been dramas , rumours players falling out with management . County board cockups . Mickey Moran sacking after a great 2006 , JOM brought back , great players missing out Ciaran Mac , Kevin O’Neill , DB , Alan Roche , Mortimers . McHale park redevelopment cost , The way McStay was treated last year. It is an amateur sport so I do have sympathy for all parties including the county board .
    I think Martin Carney is talking the most sense asking who do the players want ? Hard to see anyone doing better , Will they win sam next year very hard to see it realistically.
    I’d love to know what their problem if there was one with Liam McHale . I think most Mayo fans consider him a legend

  28. If you were a neutral, watching this play out over the last 36 hours would surely be fascinating. The amount of agendas at play, the amount of voices in the debate, the rush to avoid taking responsibility. At this point I feel sorry for Leeroy being singled out when no other player has been named, and I’d certainly have questions as to the motives behind that particular piece.

  29. The writer of that piece in the Connacht was one of Paddy McNicholas’s greatest supporters and one of James Horan’s greatest critics. Has anyone ever seen an article he wrote that is critical of the county board. Agendas everywhere folks, beware.

  30. If I was a parent of one of our players I too would have been prompting them to do

    what they did.

    Inter county football nowadays is very intense at top level. Fellas have to put their

    social lives on hold. Sometimes their careers on hold. It`s no use the crew straining

    every muscle and sinew if they don`t think the people on the bridge have got their

    bearings right.right. Belief and confidence in the management structure (or any part

    thereof) is a sine qua non.

  31. I felt sorry for Vincent way out of his depth but it did give a glimpse of what players are dealing with I was out walking and listening at same time my face going every shade of red his comment about the poor loyal supporters was the worst! I honestly can’t see how Pat & Noel can stay now and is it really possible for Jimmy Mc Guiness or Jack O Connor to come to us can’t see it but would be fantastic ! I think Cian O Neill is another man that could get us over the line! The saga continues …

  32. The key here is speed, have the meeting and after 20 min it will be obvious to all in attendance if the current setup has a future. This issue should not drag on past this meeting.
    Apart from wanting h&c out the players must feel there is a better option to take over, wonder is that JH? Not sure that would be wise, he did have his chance.
    Hindsight is a marvellous thing, I heard JH on off the ball recently about AOS and how easy it easy to double team a big full forward. Really? 12 months on from failing twice to cope with Donaghy. Be careful what u wish for!

  33. The author of that piece in the Connaught has an obvious agenda.

    No quotes from Leeroy. Even if he did vote against it he is to be supported as much as those that

    Interest that the Connaught Telegraph never have online articles but two yesterday very pro management. THey don’t have many readers or much interesting to say but they are obviously close to the management

  34. It is an embarrassment that this is still going on and it’s only going to get worse for mayo football as a whole. As martys report says there was reports of discontent for a while so forget about the dublin game. Furthermore 27 people out of 34 voted against the management so how in the name of god cab they have no intention of resigning. What are they gonna do drop 27 lads.
    Also horan coming back after a year off will be another embarrassment. He is as guilty as any mayo manager of tactical naivety (eg. Final vs dublin, no plan for donaghy, even the game in london we just about got out of jail we were set up wrong). Look outside county or bring a new man in like Rochford.

    One things for sure it’s a sad day for mayo football. When the news was delivered to H&C at weekend any other duo would have resigned there and then…yet the show goes on

  35. It would appear from reports today that this story was leaked to Mayo News and Conn Telegraph. Not the first leak to a paper this year. Cillian O Connor and Keith Higgins were to meet with Co Board on Thursday to discuss vote of no confidence. This would have been the best way for the matter to be dealt with. Instead of that we are airing dirty laundry in public this week. Who are the players who are running to the media and what is their agenda.

  36. @Donedeal are you sure that the players are the ones leaking this to the media?

    Did the previous Co board chairman not go straight to the media about McStay pulling out of the race for the Job last year before even the selection committee knew he was not going forward for his interview?

  37. The latest from the camp would suggest Pat and Noel have no intention of stepping down. Looking more like a stand off, short term anyway.Thursday night’s meeting if it happens, is now going to be High Noon, with guns at the ready and all that. You can be sure the Co Board are now pulling the strings and will try and bluff their way through another shambles, protecting their asses will be foremost in their minds, with Mayo football a distant second. If the players want to win this one, they’re going to have to hang tough and stick together.

  38. A tough situation for all involved – from the outside Pat and Noel haven’t done a whole hell of a lot wrong but obviously there is an awful lot that goes on inside closed doors that we as supporters would never know about.

    Regardless of the issues if the vast majority of a squad containing 5 or 6 players from the managers clubs vote that hey have no confidence and have seriously thought this through then the management have to go. It’s pointless carrying on.

    Presumably the players think there is someone else out there who may do a better job. It could be someone close to the group, Cian O’Neill mentioned, but perhaps Donie Buckley who the players obviously have a lot of time for.

  39. I’d like to take up a point with Macs Left Boot, I don’t think you can assume that the Castlebar players on the Panel, in fact there are five Mitchles players , Barry Moran, Tom Cunniffe, Paddy Durcan, Danny Kirby, and Neil Douglas, all voted for Holmes (and by assoation “The Management”) because of club loyalty, Maybe they did, maybe they didn’t maybe they all didn’t vote the same. I don’t know was it a secret vote or not? In any case the vote of” No Confidence ” was carried by the majority, so majority rules or does it?? In any case, any player is entitled to hold a different view to the majority and to voice that view, But I don’t think that that’s the wise way to go. Some supporters of county board decisions might like to drive a wedge between players at this stage. . Personally I think it’s a very brave decision by the players, not a decision without risks tough. There is a risk the the current management will not go, I think it’s game over if this happens? If C&H exit as they certainly should, who do we get to replace them?? no prospective manager comes with a guaranteed of future success or of future acceptance by this groupe of players? I read the piece on the Connacht telegraph relating to Lee Keegan backing C&H, from a scorce (un named) close to the player. If I told someone how I voted in a ballot and then that person went to some journalist and went public. I’d never again tell him or her anything. It’s no harm to be a bit scepital of what you read, especially of “sources close to the player”. But now we have crossed “The Rubicon” there is no going back, This Team of players, without doubt the most dedicated, most talented and best we have ever had, must hang together or surely the will hang separately and our dreams of glory and Sam will be in hibernation for God knows how long. But all is far from lost, decisive action now, get the right Manager in place and itnstill can be ours. Courage is now what is required from all, it is incumbent on the county board to act on the best interest of Mayo football, and let the actions and mistakes of last year be a thing of the past. It’s time for the county board to cross “the Rubicon ” as well!

  40. As many posters have stated- Managers manage and players play. Look at Donaghy in Kerry, captain and dropped, came in and showed he would have made a difference. He had to take it on the chin. Showed a real team player and believe me im no fan. But he did it for the team – took the orders. As I said before I fear JH has created a monster, the players are dictating the show, they were giving too much creedance under his reign. What do they expect someone to come in with a magic wand. Their coming across poorly now with Keegan being outed. Only in Mayo!
    Last time i checked you won All Ireland they are not handed out.

  41. It’s unfortunate that things have reached this stage.We know something or things are not what they should be and that’s as much as we know.I think perhaps the players could have had a statement into the CB in private as a more appropriate way of airing views.And maybe they did…we don’t know! Surely Vincent Nearys ‘procedure’ is there fior this.I would tend to presume that the players would have considered this approach and therefore I would feel that the onus rests with the CB to rectify this conflict of interests ASAP. Roll on Thurs night!

    If players needs are not heard or met then maybe a non playing advocate position could be instituted as a liaison.

    It has to be remembered also that media is in the business of making hay however and whenever it can. Vincent would have been smarter not to have presented himself for that interview. Also, Martin Carney didn’t crown himself in glory either.When one has nothing to say maybe one should say nothing.
    Someone mentioned humility in this context and I feel strongly that this quality is what’s called for here.

    And , lookit , a big step forward can be taken by all and let’s hope that the weeks ahead will be witness to this!

  42. If the players liasion is one of the managers brother to what extent did they think their messages were being filtered? It’s a safe assumption to say that that was not an ideal situation.
    There is no way there would be a 27-7 vote against Management without good reason. Also, yes, It might not be them leaking these stories.

  43. @ team sheet.. Kieran Donaghy has never played on a Mayo team. He hasnt dealt with the set up that mayo boys have..Would he have ” taken the orders ” for any longer than they have ? God knows..

  44. Ken re your majority rules post you are missing my point maybe I should be clearer in future. Yes majority rules but….
    I’m confused because I assumed those voting to keep the lads were either from castlebar or hollymount or were on the 2006 team, a sort of past/club loyalty thing. Lee has been one of our best players in the last 5 years if not our best so with no real past connection to the lads it seems to be a genuine backing.

  45. Mac’s Left Boot

    From speaking to some Mitchels players over the course of the year I would hazard a guess that the Castlebar players would be first to get rid of Holmes.

    They seemed genuinely shocked he got Mayo job and had no time for him at all.

  46. @ger bohan you’re right. And lads the mitchells players vote is irrelevant. 27 out of 34 is pretty conclusive. That’s like saying we can assume the 3 o sheas voted the same. It’s irrelevant who voted what. What’s relevant is their position as joint managers is now unsustainable.

  47. Fair enough re mitchells lads, I did add that it was by no means certain they all voted for holmes btw. 7 players is a substantial number to vote in favour of H and C, particularly if it was 7 first team players. That would be a disaster. If it was only one or two, and the rest were fringe players then it wouldn’t be as bad. I don’t live in the country at all, so not close to panel or rumours, but I notice a few people including WJ suggesting one member of the management team in particular was out of favour with the players. I guess I will have to do a bit of scouting around elsewhere to find out which one it is! Don’t want to break the rules by gossiping here!

  48. I don’t think I suggested that, Mac’s left boot – I did say it was my understanding (from a number of sources) that one of the co-managers has indicated he’s ready to step down.

  49. It’s really a mess isn’t it. Feel sorry for the management and players really. I wonder what the role of Buckley and solan is, were they part of the problem or are they exempt from criticism in the eyes of the players? The question in the ballot appeared to refer to the management team, wonder does that extend to all management team members?

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